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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 7:57:18 GMT
My mixup then with the TV stations. My apologies. Never really paid much attention to who was airing it. I just see MM and simply tune in. MM was originally commissioned by City TV for three movies. They were successful so City ordered a series which they cancelled after season 5. CBC picked it up for season 6, they also bought the rights to season 5 to be shown as (I'm guessing) an introduction to the series (for those who can't get City) whilst season 6 was in production. It's been airing almost every day on City since it took off on CBC, sellers remorse maybe or it's one of the only Canadian shows they've got, wouldn't really know as I've never watched City (until MM) even when we could get it. It may not be seller's remorse: perhaps they just offloaded the cost of actually producing the show. City said MM got good ratings, but didn't fit into their current "directions". Maybe their "direction" failed, lol. Anyway, they are cashing in on CBC's success. |
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Post by Fallenbelle on Aug 31, 2014 11:36:14 GMT
I don't think PBS is the right channel because they won't "spam" MM the way it would need to be spammed to gain popularity. It looks like the last time they only picked up Season 1, which is kind of a patchy season - MM was still trying to find it's footing. Then if that season doesn't catch on, they might drop it. What I'm looking for is what MGM did with Stargate. They did weekend reruns on a mainstream channel (I think Fox). Then they SPAMMED daily reruns of seasons 1-5 on the SyFy channel while airing a new Season 6. People got addicted because of those reruns, so the new episodes became very popular despite Stargate being on the "hokey" end of TV shows. SyFy quickly capitalized with spinoffs. The same can be said for the popularity of NCIS. This show only started to command ratings because it was syndicated and the reruns were being spammed everywhere. The parent company owned both the network channel and cable channels. The unfortunate thing is there isn't a mystery niche channel that is as common on low end cable packages as the SyFy channel. Stargate is a really good comparison though, because the content never went beyond "family" friendly, but somehow it really caught on in the US. One thing it did have, though, that MM doesn't have, was all the classes of star ships for battletech nerds, and the tacit approval of the U.S. Air Force. But Stargate was a US made programme aimed at a US audience so there was nothing that anyone would want to change in order to make it more palatable. MM is NOT made for US audiences and therefore only appeals to a 'few'. Therefore for a network to pick it up they would probably want changes to Americanize it and that would be the ruination of it. I'm sorry but I don't want another of my shows ruined just so it can be shown to a larger US audience. I don't think it was ever intended to be shown to a mass market in the US. It wasn't even made to be shown to a mass market in Canada, City TV is only available in the larger cities in the country. It's only since it's been on CBC that it's been available to the entire population of Canada. I still think PBS is the place for it as it's more like the British shows than anything else. I suspect PBS isn't interested because it's Canadian and Canadian shows have a reputation of not being very good (even here) though I consider many of them some of the best ... but only the quirky ones, not really interested in the mainstream programming. I must be one of the only people in Canada that can't stand Republic of Doyle! The thing to remember is that PBS is a franchise of sorts. There's the parent PBS or Public Broadcasting Service, that is the umbrella for all the smaller, local channels that serve various US cities. It's not a national network like Discovery, Nat Geo, etc. Think of it like a fast food restaurant-it has a parent corporate office that directs some of their actions, but still allows for local flavor/interests. So, for example, I can't think of a PBS station that doesn't carry a standard bearer like Masterpiece Theater, or Mystery! (British crime dramas/mysteries), but not every single PBS station would have carried MM. I don't know for sure since I haven't lived in the States for years, but I suspect that not every PBS station carried it, which means that while it may have technically aired in the U.S., not every American would have had access to it. I'd be curious to see which station/s were the broadcasters. As far as a recommended channel, might I recommend BBC America. |
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Post by Fallenbelle on Aug 31, 2014 11:54:10 GMT
I don't think PBS is the right channel because they won't "spam" MM the way it would need to be spammed to gain popularity. It looks like the last time they only picked up Season 1, which is kind of a patchy season - MM was still trying to find it's footing. Then if that season doesn't catch on, they might drop it. What I'm looking for is what MGM did with Stargate. They did weekend reruns on a mainstream channel (I think Fox). Then they SPAMMED daily reruns of seasons 1-5 on the SyFy channel while airing a new Season 6. People got addicted because of those reruns, so the new episodes became very popular despite Stargate being on the "hokey" end of TV shows. SyFy quickly capitalized with spinoffs. The same can be said for the popularity of NCIS. This show only started to command ratings because it was syndicated and the reruns were being spammed everywhere. The parent company owned both the network channel and cable channels. The unfortunate thing is there isn't a mystery niche channel that is as common on low end cable packages as the SyFy channel. Stargate is a really good comparison though, because the content never went beyond "family" friendly, but somehow it really caught on in the US. One thing it did have, though, that MM doesn't have, was all the classes of star ships for battletech nerds, and the tacit approval of the U.S. Air Force. But Stargate was a US made programme aimed at a US audience so there was nothing that anyone would want to change in order to make it more palatable. MM is NOT made for US audiences and therefore only appeals to a 'few'. Therefore for a network to pick it up they would probably want changes to Americanize it and that would be the ruination of it. I'm sorry but I don't want another of my shows ruined just so it can be shown to a larger US audience. I don't think it was ever intended to be shown to a mass market in the US. It wasn't even made to be shown to a mass market in Canada, City TV is only available in the larger cities in the country. It's only since it's been on CBC that it's been available to the entire population of Canada. I still think PBS is the place for it as it's more like the British shows than anything else. I suspect PBS isn't interested because it's Canadian and Canadian shows have a reputation of not being very good (even here) though I consider many of them some of the best ... but only the quirky ones, not really interested in the mainstream programming. I must be one of the only people in Canada that can't stand Republic of Doyle! But the average American wouldn't know about Canadian program standards. I didn't know until you mentioned it. Therefore, they wouldn't care. I can think of quite a few shows that were made in Canada that Americans have watched, and I don't think a lot of us care where the show is made so long as it is good. Also, I don't think Snacky mentioned messing with the format of MM, she believes (as well as I) that a lot of Americans would enjoy the show, if they only knew about it. Her complaint is not how the show is made, but rather how it is marketed here in the US. There is a market for it here in the States, and Ovation, bless their little hearts, isn't getting that part right. |
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Post by Hodge on Aug 31, 2014 15:30:03 GMT
But Stargate was a US made programme aimed at a US audience so there was nothing that anyone would want to change in order to make it more palatable. MM is NOT made for US audiences and therefore only appeals to a 'few'. Therefore for a network to pick it up they would probably want changes to Americanize it and that would be the ruination of it. I'm sorry but I don't want another of my shows ruined just so it can be shown to a larger US audience. I don't think it was ever intended to be shown to a mass market in the US. It wasn't even made to be shown to a mass market in Canada, City TV is only available in the larger cities in the country. It's only since it's been on CBC that it's been available to the entire population of Canada. I still think PBS is the place for it as it's more like the British shows than anything else. I suspect PBS isn't interested because it's Canadian and Canadian shows have a reputation of not being very good (even here) though I consider many of them some of the best ... but only the quirky ones, not really interested in the mainstream programming. I must be one of the only people in Canada that can't stand Republic of Doyle! Stargate was made in Canada but sold to a U.S. audience - first to the Showtime cable channel (compare that to being stuck on City TV) and then it was bought first by MGM and then by the SyFy channel (which took over new episodes at season 6, compare to CBC, and made Stargate popular). It used a lot of Canadian actors. In a way I think that's why the story structure and "family friendly" aspect is similar to MM. (I find it interesting that the X-Files, which I also liked, was also produced in Canada). I don't see how Stargate was changed beyond the story time getting shorter to accommodate more commercials. That might happen to MM while it's still in Canada, given the plight of the CBC. I think MM is much closer story structure/pacing wise to Stargate than it is to anything on PBS here - even including Dr. Who and Sherlock. I think PBS would bury it simply because of the backup of too many past seasons for syndication, and not enough PBS timeslots to show it. If MM can be picked up by one of the larger media monopolies that owns multiple channels, then it might be able to get the same sort of broad exposure Stargate and NCIS got. (I'm not kidding myself that MM would ever get the level of exposure that NCIS gets - it's not "mainstream" enough - but I think Stargate, a niche show, is a fair comparison). X-files whilst being made in Canada was still a US production, making use of Canadian facilities and actors but made for a US audience. I think the same is true of Stargate. This makes them vastly different from Canadian productions made primarily for a Canadian audience and whilst there is UK money involved it's still made mainly for Canada and that is why it's a Canadian format. I've seen some recent episodes of Dr. Who and that has changed vastly from the early years. Once again the pacing has increased and I think that's mainly due to it becoming popular around the world but mainly in the US. I've never seen Sherlock and I really don't have any interest. I assume it's a present day Sherlock Holmes. There is only one Sherlock Holmes for me and that's Jeremy Brett. I guess I still like my shows very 'British' in style as I was a fan of Midsomer Murders (with John Nettles), Frost, Foyle's War, Morse etc. I don't like my shows being tampered with just to satisfy a different audience. |
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Post by Hodge on Aug 31, 2014 15:40:50 GMT
MM was originally commissioned by City TV for three movies. They were successful so City ordered a series which they cancelled after season 5. CBC picked it up for season 6, they also bought the rights to season 5 to be shown as (I'm guessing) an introduction to the series (for those who can't get City) whilst season 6 was in production. It's been airing almost every day on City since it took off on CBC, sellers remorse maybe or it's one of the only Canadian shows they've got, wouldn't really know as I've never watched City (until MM) even when we could get it. It may not be seller's remorse: perhaps they just offloaded the cost of actually producing the show. City said MM got good ratings, but didn't fit into their current "directions". Maybe their "direction" failed, lol. Anyway, they are cashing in on CBC's success. As far as I'm concerned City TV just fails on all counts, I find their shows mind numbingly inane. MM was certainly out of place there but kudos to them for taking it on in the first place the only sensible thing they've ever done! Once they offloaded the show they didn't just offload the cost, they did themselves out of the best show that's ever been on TV ... and I still can't believe I'm saying that of a programme that started on City!! MM is too intelligent for City's "directions" as you put it, their directions have always failed for me. Not quite sure what demographic their viewers fit into but obviously I'm not in it.... |
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Post by Hodge on Aug 31, 2014 16:02:27 GMT
But Stargate was a US made programme aimed at a US audience so there was nothing that anyone would want to change in order to make it more palatable. MM is NOT made for US audiences and therefore only appeals to a 'few'. Therefore for a network to pick it up they would probably want changes to Americanize it and that would be the ruination of it. I'm sorry but I don't want another of my shows ruined just so it can be shown to a larger US audience. I don't think it was ever intended to be shown to a mass market in the US. It wasn't even made to be shown to a mass market in Canada, City TV is only available in the larger cities in the country. It's only since it's been on CBC that it's been available to the entire population of Canada. I still think PBS is the place for it as it's more like the British shows than anything else. I suspect PBS isn't interested because it's Canadian and Canadian shows have a reputation of not being very good (even here) though I consider many of them some of the best ... but only the quirky ones, not really interested in the mainstream programming. I must be one of the only people in Canada that can't stand Republic of Doyle! But the average American wouldn't know about Canadian program standards. I didn't know until you mentioned it. Therefore, they wouldn't care. I can think of quite a few shows that were made in Canada that Americans have watched, and I don't think a lot of us care where the show is made so long as it is good. Also, I don't think Snacky mentioned messing with the format of MM, she believes (as well as I) that a lot of Americans would enjoy the show, if they only knew about it. Her complaint is not how the show is made, but rather how it is marketed here in the US. There is a market for it here in the States, and Ovation, bless their little hearts, isn't getting that part right. I understand that and I don't think the audience do care, they find a programme they like and watch it. The problem isn't the audience, it's the networks. They're too tempted to change things to make a show more 'accessible' to a wider audience to bring in even more viewers (and advertising) rather than being content with the niche audience. No, Snacky didn't mention messing with the format, that was me. It's happened before with Canadian shows that got picked up in the US, I'm worried it will happen again. It really is too bad that a channel can't pick it up and run with it. |
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Post by Hodge on Aug 31, 2014 16:15:03 GMT
The thing to remember is that PBS is a franchise of sorts. There's the parent PBS or Public Broadcasting Service, that is the umbrella for all the smaller, local channels that serve various US cities. It's not a national network like Discovery, Nat Geo, etc. Think of it like a fast food restaurant-it has a parent corporate office that directs some of their actions, but still allows for local flavor/interests. So, for example, I can't think of a PBS station that doesn't carry a standard bearer like Masterpiece Theater, or Mystery! (British crime dramas/mysteries), but not every single PBS station would have carried MM. I don't know for sure since I haven't lived in the States for years, but I suspect that not every PBS station carried it, which means that while it may have technically aired in the U.S., not every American would have had access to it. I'd be curious to see which station/s were the broadcasters. As far as a recommended channel, might I recommend BBC America. I understand the PBS system as we've watched it for years on cable/satellite or over the airwaves from Detroit (which is an excellent PBS channel). There are quite a few British shows that seem to be on most of the PBS channels and I would hope MM could be too. BBC America would never air MM as it's partially funded by ITV, BBC's rival. |
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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 17:22:41 GMT
The thing to remember is that PBS is a franchise of sorts. There's the parent PBS or Public Broadcasting Service, that is the umbrella for all the smaller, local channels that serve various US cities. It's not a national network like Discovery, Nat Geo, etc. Think of it like a fast food restaurant-it has a parent corporate office that directs some of their actions, but still allows for local flavor/interests. So, for example, I can't think of a PBS station that doesn't carry a standard bearer like Masterpiece Theater, or Mystery! (British crime dramas/mysteries), but not every single PBS station would have carried MM. I don't know for sure since I haven't lived in the States for years, but I suspect that not every PBS station carried it, which means that while it may have technically aired in the U.S., not every American would have had access to it. They seem to use umbrella "distributors" like "American Public Television". That's what made the purchase of 1 season of MM in 2009: www.aptonline.org/catalog.nsf/AlphaLookup/C5DFD9CD21E9C4F8852575AE0057DBE7By the way, do you see a link to AcornTV at the bottom of that listing? I'm trying to figure out if that link is actually there or if an Acorn cookie is still inserting links on all possible related web pages. btw, the down side of BBC America is I don't think it's broadly carried on TV cable packages - at least not as broadly, as say USA or the SyFy channel. But call me out if I'm wrong on that. I've just had Dish for years, and I've never had the BBC channel in any of the packages we've had. |
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Post by monty151 on Aug 31, 2014 17:31:40 GMT
MM is not funded by ITV. It is distributed by ITV. Alibi is part of UKTV which is part owned by BBC worldwide. That is why a lot of drama on Alibi are BBC dramas. I think BBC America is part of BBC worldwide so maybe BBC America is the way to go.
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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 17:35:01 GMT
X-files whilst being made in Canada was still a US production, making use of Canadian facilities and actors but made for a US audience. I think the same is true of Stargate. This makes them vastly different from Canadian productions made primarily for a Canadian audience and whilst there is UK money involved it's still made mainly for Canada and that is why it's a Canadian format. I've seen some recent episodes of Dr. Who and that has changed vastly from the early years. Once again the pacing has increased and I think that's mainly due to it becoming popular around the world but mainly in the US. I've never seen Sherlock and I really don't have any interest. I assume it's a present day Sherlock Holmes. There is only one Sherlock Holmes for me and that's Jeremy Brett. I guess I still like my shows very 'British' in style as I was a fan of Midsomer Murders (with John Nettles), Frost, Foyle's War, Morse etc. I don't like my shows being tampered with just to satisfy a different audience. Even if the X-Files and Stargate were being made for US audiences, they must have picked up Canadian tastes while they were there. They were outliers in US TV, and both surprise hits here. Both of them, and especially Stargate, are very much closer to MM in storytelling mood, pacing, etc. I could see MM being made in the same studio as Stargate. On the other hand, I don't see MM as having much in common with the British mysteries I see on PBS at all, aside from being set in a historical period and being based on mysteries. Someone on Reddit kept insisting that MM was "like" Mrs. Fisher Mysteries. Those happened to appear on PBS the other day. Not the same thing at all. Mrs. Fisher is a PBS Brit-style mystery. MM does not fall in that "vibe" at all. What would be cool is if MM could appear in both places: PBS to pick up people who might associate it with Brit Mysteries because of the historical setting and sleuthing, but also on a channel with "American paced" programming, because it's also that. |
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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 17:49:10 GMT
As far as I'm concerned City TV just fails on all counts, I find their shows mind numbingly inane. MM was certainly out of place there but kudos to them for taking it on in the first place the only sensible thing they've ever done! Once they offloaded the show they didn't just offload the cost, they did themselves out of the best show that's ever been on TV ... and I still can't believe I'm saying that of a programme that started on City!! MM is too intelligent for City's "directions" as you put it, their directions have always failed for me. Not quite sure what demographic their viewers fit into but obviously I'm not in it.... hahaha, that's how I feel about just about all TV sponsored/made in America. Someone in City TV must have spent too much time partying in Los Angeles! My guess is that originally MM was just a small, cheap period piece based on the Jennings novels. But MM became such a hybrid concept that it became even harder to sell to distributors. That might have been another reason City TV needed to offload it. Perhaps they needed those distribution deals to help fund MM, but they couldn't get them. Perhaps they had been counting on that PBS deal. |
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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 17:57:35 GMT
It's happened before with Canadian shows that got picked up in the US, I'm worried it will happen again. It really is too bad that a channel can't pick it up and run with it. Ooooh, I get what you mean. Your concern is if American money gets involved, they will try to dictate certain "changes" to *Shaftesbury* to make MM more appealing to what they think their advertising demographic wants. So MM gradually evolves into, say, Reign. I doubt that would happen because MM seems to be considered a "Canadian" show, and there would be some outrage if Americans tried to dictate anything concerning it. The audience in the US would probably be considered a "niche" one, the American backers would probably be like: "We have no idea what you did, but please keep on doing it." But the bigger worry would be American money coming in, MM growing dependent on it, ratings dropping for some reason, capricious Americans pulling out, and that leading to the cancellation of MM - taking MM away from the Canadians as well as the Americans for reasons that had nothing to do with the Canadians at all. So, yeah, American involvement has a dark side. Maybe it's possible to talk about American distribution without direct American investment? |
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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 18:01:34 GMT
MM is not funded by ITV. It is distributed by ITV. Alibi is part of UKTV which is part owned by BBC worldwide. That is why a lot of drama on Alibi are BBC dramas. I think BBC America is part of BBC worldwide so maybe BBC America is the way to go. I still don't think BBC America is widely watched here. I'm baffled on how Orphan Black, which is the only show becoming popular off of BBC America I've ever heard of, got the recognition it did. I doubt it's through direct watching on TV. I think people saw news about it on the Internet and download it some other way. |
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Post by Hodge on Aug 31, 2014 18:02:42 GMT
X-files whilst being made in Canada was still a US production, making use of Canadian facilities and actors but made for a US audience. I think the same is true of Stargate. This makes them vastly different from Canadian productions made primarily for a Canadian audience and whilst there is UK money involved it's still made mainly for Canada and that is why it's a Canadian format. I've seen some recent episodes of Dr. Who and that has changed vastly from the early years. Once again the pacing has increased and I think that's mainly due to it becoming popular around the world but mainly in the US. I've never seen Sherlock and I really don't have any interest. I assume it's a present day Sherlock Holmes. There is only one Sherlock Holmes for me and that's Jeremy Brett. I guess I still like my shows very 'British' in style as I was a fan of Midsomer Murders (with John Nettles), Frost, Foyle's War, Morse etc. I don't like my shows being tampered with just to satisfy a different audience. Even if the X-Files and Stargate were being made for US audiences, they must have picked up Canadian tastes while they were there. They were outliers in US TV, and both surprise hits here. Both of them, and especially Stargate, are very much closer to MM in storytelling mood, pacing, etc. I could see MM being made in the same studio as Stargate. On the other hand, I don't see MM as having much in common with the British mysteries I see on PBS at all, aside from being set in a historical period and being based on mysteries. Someone on Reddit kept insisting that MM was "like" Mrs. Fisher Mysteries. Those happened to appear on PBS the other day. Not the same thing at all. Mrs. Fisher is a PBS Brit-style mystery. MM does not fall in that "vibe" at all. What would be cool is if MM could appear in both places: PBS to pick up people who might associate it with Brit Mysteries because of the historical setting and sleuthing, but also on a channel with "American paced" programming, because it's also that. X-files was made in BC and I suspect Stargate was as well. MM is filmed in a studio in Toronto and street and indoor scenes requiring Victorian decor in a couple of towns just west of Toronto where there's less traffic for outdoors and many more original Victorian homes and buildings. It's funny that you get an American vibe from MM but I get more of a British one, perhaps it lands somewhere in the middle, a Canadian vibe maybe....  |
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Post by snacky on Aug 31, 2014 18:19:27 GMT
It's funny that you get an American vibe from MM but I get more of a British one, perhaps it lands somewhere in the middle, a Canadian vibe maybe.... Yes, Stargate was made around Vancouver. So, while it had lots of villains with Canadian accents, their villains were mostly different from the Toronto villains with Canadian accents.  Perhaps if you live in Canada it moves your cultural sensitivity dial toward Britain. But you may not really understand what I'm talking about because I watched Stargate as obsessively as I watch MM now, whereas you probably only have a passing familiarity with that show. It goes beyond the structural similarities: the pacing, the beats, etc. are close to American. The difference is in the "types" of stories told, and perhaps the humor as well. They are clearly structured morality tales, closer to stage plays, favoring a bit of symbolism. They aren't as raunchy, corrupt, and pornish as American shows tend to be. Just having said that, I'm wondering if it's easier to "ship" Canadian, and if certain American writers who have pioneered in the "cult TV" style here - say, Joss Whedon - were influenced by the Canadian style in this respect. Anyway, I do think there is a bit of Canadian secret sauce, and even shows made for American distribution in Canada benefit from it. |
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Jan 30, 2013 21:44:55 GMT