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Post by snacky on Apr 25, 2015 5:03:24 GMT
Sorry, but I don't agree with that interpretation of book William. You're taking the whole Enid/Alwyn thing out of context, IMO, and when you've read all of the books, a very different picture emerges. It's also pretty clear that while book William was looking for a wife, he was lonely, and wanted companionship above all else. If he'd just wanted a housekeeper with sexual benefits, he would have married Enid. He was craving intimacy, and if you read the books with Amy Slade, he wants a companion and an equal. But yes, while I think he wanted a bit of mothering from Mrs. Kitchen, he doesn't want a lot from his lover-see Enid feeding him in Convalesence and that look between him and Julia-she knows there's a difference between nursing and mothering-Enid was treating him like Alwyn, IMO. He didn't like it. Yep, it's because the only books I read were the Enid/Alwyn ones: these did not present a very mature picture of William. Great point of comparison from the TV show since Convalescence also features Enid. William was about to crawl out of his skin from being "mommy'd" there, but yet he tried it. Looking for love in all the wrong places~ |
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Post by Fallenbelle on Apr 25, 2015 5:06:30 GMT
Yes, he didn't seem to be holding back from Liza at all. But the way he was staying committed to her over a year after her death was also very strange. Was he intending to remain a bachelor the rest of his life in order to remain faithful to her? How long was official mourning for a fiancee in Victorian times? I'm guessing Liza was his first love and I think we can also assume that he was very much in love with her and as such had a long mourning especially for a man. Mourning seems to have been mainly the domain of women especially for their husbands but there were proscribed mourning periods depend on relationship. It was only when Liza released him that he moved on. From this I think we can assume that he may have held on to her for much longer had it not been for Miss Pensall. That's where the first season gets confusing for me. In Power, it opens up on William and Julia picnicking in the park together-quite romantic, and it seems to be picking up from the movies. Then in subsequent episodes, William seems to be in mourning again but definitely making eyes at Julia. This is where that alternate order of season one may explain things... But in the books and the movies, he still misses Liza, but he's making the effort to get back out there. He's in mourning, but he's not planning on being there for the rest of his life. TV William? Who knows? |
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Post by Hodge on Apr 25, 2015 5:08:52 GMT
Sorry, but I don't agree with that interpretation of book William. You're taking the whole Enid/Alwyn thing out of context, IMO, and when you've read all of the books, a very different picture emerges. It's also pretty clear that while book William was looking for a wife, he was lonely, and wanted companionship above all else. If he'd just wanted a housekeeper with sexual benefits, he would have married Enid. He was craving intimacy, and if you read the books with Amy Slade, he wants a companion and an equal. But yes, while I think he wanted a bit of mothering from Mrs. Kitchen, he doesn't want a lot from his lover-see Enid feeding him in Convalesence and that look between him and Julia-she knows there's a difference between nursing and mothering-Enid was treating him like Alwyn, IMO. He didn't like it. Yep, it's because the only books I read were the Enid/Alwyn ones: these did not present a very mature picture of William. Great point of comparison from the TV show since Convalescence also features Enid. William was about to crawl out of his skin from being "mommy'd" there, but yet he tried it. Looking for love in all the wrong places~ You should try and read all the books. Whilst I didn't like book William very much I got to the point that I didn't mind him as much in the later books. You can't form a proper opinion of him from just a couple of books. |
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Post by snacky on Apr 25, 2015 5:31:04 GMT
That's where the first season gets confusing for me. In Power, it opens up on William and Julia picnicking in the park together-quite romantic, and it seems to be picking up from the movies. Then in subsequent episodes, William seems to be in mourning again but definitely making eyes at Julia. This is where that alternate order of season one may explain things... But in the books and the movies, he still misses Liza, but he's making the effort to get back out there. He's in mourning, but he's not planning on being there for the rest of his life. TV William? Who knows? In Power they could be just friends, but in Glass Ceiling they are definitely flirting. This is where the "William has mental issues" interpretation of Season 1" comes in so handy! |
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Post by snacky on Apr 25, 2015 5:35:04 GMT
You should try and read all the books. Whilst I didn't like book William very much I got to the point that I didn't mind him as much in the later books. You can't form a proper opinion of him from just a couple of books. Our public library only has 3.  |
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Post by Hodge on Apr 25, 2015 6:06:05 GMT
That's where the first season gets confusing for me. In Power, it opens up on William and Julia picnicking in the park together-quite romantic, and it seems to be picking up from the movies. Then in subsequent episodes, William seems to be in mourning again but definitely making eyes at Julia. This is where that alternate order of season one may explain things... But in the books and the movies, he still misses Liza, but he's making the effort to get back out there. He's in mourning, but he's not planning on being there for the rest of his life. TV William? Who knows? In Power they could be just friends, but in Glass Ceiling they are definitely flirting. This is where the "William has mental issues" interpretation of Season 1" comes in so handy! The whole of S1 makes much more sense if you watch it in the alternate order. Whilst Power is a great introduction to the series and makes a great pilot of sorts it's way too far into the season to really make sense of the romance. The first three eps of the alternate order sets up William's biography. Glass Ceiling introduces William and sets up his past. It also introduces Julia and makes it obvious she has a thing for him. Elementary, My Dear Murdoch tells a little more of his past by expanding on Liza then releases him from her so he can now move on. Let Loose the Dogs tells of his past family life and releases him from his perceived view of his father and what happened to his mother. These three eps also introduce William's relationship with Julia. After these eps the relationship starts to move forward though very slowly. It's not just Power that is out of order, though you can watch other eps between them William's biography and the progression of the relationship is much clearer if viewed in this order. |
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Post by snacky on Apr 25, 2015 18:54:48 GMT
The whole of S1 makes much more sense if you watch it in the alternate order. Whilst Power is a great introduction to the series and makes a great pilot of sorts it's way too far into the season to really make sense of the romance. The first three eps of the alternate order sets up William's biography. Glass Ceiling introduces William and sets up his past. It also introduces Julia and makes it obvious she has a thing for him. Elementary, My Dear Murdoch tells a little more of his past by expanding on Liza then releases him from her so he can now move on. Let Loose the Dogs tells of his past family life and releases him from his perceived view of his father and what happened to his mother. These three eps also introduce William's relationship with Julia. After these eps the relationship starts to move forward though very slowly. It's not just Power that is out of order, though you can watch other eps between them William's biography and the progression of the relationship is much clearer if viewed in this order. Oops. I had Glass Ceiling confused with The Knockdown, too. So you're right - these do make more sense in terms of slow progression of relationship - and they might even dovetail with the movies. (though they wouldn't be able to explain William doing dancing lessons with Julia twice...). |
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Post by Fallenbelle on Apr 26, 2015 2:13:29 GMT
You should try and read all the books. Whilst I didn't like book William very much I got to the point that I didn't mind him as much in the later books. You can't form a proper opinion of him from just a couple of books. Our public library only has 3. Do they not have interlibrary loan? In Texas anyway, pretty much every library is in a network, and if your local doesn't have a particular book, they'll get it from one who does. |
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Post by Fallenbelle on Apr 26, 2015 2:15:38 GMT
In Power they could be just friends, but in Glass Ceiling they are definitely flirting. This is where the "William has mental issues" interpretation of Season 1" comes in so handy! The whole of S1 makes much more sense if you watch it in the alternate order. Whilst Power is a great introduction to the series and makes a great pilot of sorts it's way too far into the season to really make sense of the romance. The first three eps of the alternate order sets up William's biography. Glass Ceiling introduces William and sets up his past. It also introduces Julia and makes it obvious she has a thing for him. Elementary, My Dear Murdoch tells a little more of his past by expanding on Liza then releases him from her so he can now move on. Let Loose the Dogs tells of his past family life and releases him from his perceived view of his father and what happened to his mother. These three eps also introduce William's relationship with Julia. After these eps the relationship starts to move forward though very slowly. It's not just Power that is out of order, though you can watch other eps between them William's biography and the progression of the relationship is much clearer if viewed in this order. I know you've posted it before, but what is the alternate order? I can't remember where we originally discussed this in our wonderful quagmire of MM obsession!  |
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Post by Hodge on Apr 26, 2015 2:52:08 GMT
The whole of S1 makes much more sense if you watch it in the alternate order. Whilst Power is a great introduction to the series and makes a great pilot of sorts it's way too far into the season to really make sense of the romance. The first three eps of the alternate order sets up William's biography. Glass Ceiling introduces William and sets up his past. It also introduces Julia and makes it obvious she has a thing for him. Elementary, My Dear Murdoch tells a little more of his past by expanding on Liza then releases him from her so he can now move on. Let Loose the Dogs tells of his past family life and releases him from his perceived view of his father and what happened to his mother. These three eps also introduce William's relationship with Julia. After these eps the relationship starts to move forward though very slowly. It's not just Power that is out of order, though you can watch other eps between them William's biography and the progression of the relationship is much clearer if viewed in this order. I know you've posted it before, but what is the alternate order? I can't remember where we originally discussed this in our wonderful quagmire of MM obsession! Glass Ceiling Elementary, My Dear Murdoch Let Loose the Dogs The Knockdown Body Double Till Death Us Do Part Still Waters Child's Play Power Belly Speaker The Rebel and the Prince Bad Medicine Annoying Red Planet |
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Post by snacky on Apr 26, 2015 4:07:31 GMT
Our public library only has 3. Do they not have interlibrary loan? In Texas anyway, pretty much every library is in a network, and if your local doesn't have a particular book, they'll get it from one who does. They do, but I got in trouble to the tune of $120 a couple months back. |
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Post by bidenslaptopmatters on Jun 7, 2022 16:18:18 GMT
Dr. Ogden is your typical left wing liberal whackjob. She insists on her own way even to the detriment of those who care about her. I wish Det Murdock would've stayed with Anna Fulford.
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pbc
New Member
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Post by pbc on Dec 5, 2022 3:07:04 GMT
I have just started watching this show and I love it. I am just nearing the end of season 6. I have tried to fight it but I find Julia absolutely annoying. She is so stubborn and so sure that she is always right. William needs to find someone who supports him as he supports her. Please tell me she gets better or she leaves the show!! Thank you for this I was worried no one else was thinking this. I'm in season 13 I think and from season 10-13 she's been one of the most annoying tv characters I have ever watched. I'm not sure exactly what it is but she doesn't listen to anyone and expects them to not care or help her when she does something wrong after being specifically told not to do it. I was honestly praying she was going to jail in the episode "The Killing Dose". She gets absolutely no consequences for her actions it's annoying to watch as a viewer. Don't get me started on her and William. Like he has a belief that abortions are improper and inhumane. Yet when she instructs Rebecca James exactly how to give her patient one and William finds out, she doesn't try to understand that that's his opinion and he can think whatever he wants. She decides to just kick him out of their apartment or house. She's so close-minded she won't even let her own husband having his own opinions without kicking him out. It's honestly been frustrating cause shit like that wouldn't fly in real life she'd for sure be fired and have been carted off to jail. I hope Murdoch Mysteries start actually giving her consequences for stupid shit she does it would honestly feel so satisfying to see. |
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