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Post by renaissancegirl on May 5, 2011 17:38:21 GMT
I forgot to mention--even Dr. Francis noticed what was going on and had words of advice for them. (Was that in episode 4?). Anyway, I've been quite disappointed how the writers have dragged this on. It hasn't been the most enjoyable series this time around.
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Post by hannikan on May 5, 2011 18:12:14 GMT
It was interesting that Darcy left without saying anything in the morgue, after watching them just standing and talking. I think seeing how they get wrapped up in conversation is alarming to him, now that he knows they used to have a relationship. And, if Julia wasn't lying to Ruby, and did tell Darcy about her relationship with William, without identifying him by name, he would be even more alarmed if he has any idea how much she loved him. It didn't seem to me that Julia told Darcy about anyone. She seemed to be lying to Ruby when she said that she had told him. I think she was just trying to tell herself if she had he'd be mature and understand all people (esp by their age) have a past. By the way, was anyone else surprised that Julia had told Ruby why she broke up with William, and in detail? I think I was surprised to even realize that she must have told Ruby about her abortion, and the resulting sterility. Yet still notes that Ruby has a wild streak! No, I wasn't surprised because they seemed to be very close and tell each other everything. Ruby is probably the only one who knew about Julia's abortion besides Dr. Tasch. I'm sure Julia's father doesn't know. Yeah, both sisters have a wild streak  I forgot to mention - someone else did earlier - watching William's reaction to Rupert's question of how would he feel if the woman he loved showed interest in another - I was glad to hear some passion in his frustration! Yes, he looked really tired though, too. Kind of like he did in Tattered and Torn. This whole wedding is wearing him down. |
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Post by lifeisridic on May 5, 2011 20:11:13 GMT
To tell you truthfully, I'm beginning to feel sorry for Julia and think she deserves better--even Darcy! Murdoch is beginning to look pathetic and is turning out to be like another Detective Lamb. Victorian morals or not, Murdoch should have gone after Julia when she first went to Buffalo, rather than wait 6 months later, after being summoned. You would think with all the advice he was given--from that detective in Buffalo, the French inspector etc., he would have said or done something by now. The last episode was painful to see too--just sitting there passively, absorbed in his work, while both Ruby and Brackenreid give him a big hint about 'doing something about it.' Darcy at least moved to be with Julia, and is even willing to fight for her... Clearly, something Murdoch is not willing to do. It's not as simple as that. It was Julia who left William, she is the one who got engaged to someone else. As far as William knows she has moved on and wants Darcy, she hasn't said otherwise. Her hinting is not enough as William doesn't read his own personal matters well. It's a two way street here, both Julia and William have acted like fools. If they had just spoken to each other then this wouldn't have happened. But both have assumed things about the other without actually asking the questions. Julia is as much to blame as William. Why the hell is she marrying someone else when it's clear to everyone she still loves William. William ignoring Ruby is the same thing Julia did. Neither will say what's in their heart. Lack of communication is the problem they have and the only one they do. Equal blame all around IMO. |
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Post by renaissancegirl on May 5, 2011 20:19:31 GMT
Definitely all parties are to blame, but somebody needs to break the ice! I still believe it was in Murdoch's hands to initiate something--after all, he could have contacted her sooner and perhaps Julia would not have got engaged. (She probably thought he wasn't interested any longer because of his silence, so she decided to move on). Anyway, hopefully we'll see some answers to all our questions soon!
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Post by hannikan on May 5, 2011 21:12:49 GMT
Yeah it's definitely an issue of both of them failing to communicate. Seems like a typical Victorian problem. I also think Julia leaving without telling William when she was going or saying good bye set things in motion, too. Her saying at the end of S3, maybe we'll stay together wasn't a compelling expression of her love for him either. I think he thought she wasn't really committed to their relationship anymore. And I think she was trying to separate her feelings from him because she thought he wanted children more than anything. She had to worry that having children would mean she would have to give up her career (like Annabelle was being forced to by Rupert). She also felt like she had to leap at the job opportunity because it might never come again.
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Post by kaybee on May 5, 2011 22:48:29 GMT
I think a large part of Julia taking the job in Buffalo had to do with William - I think she knows had she remained in Toronto, things would have remained the same with William, and I think she loves him more than she does herself. She sees herself as having given up the love of her life so that he can have the life he wants.
The interesting thing is that Julia knows fully well that William is obtuse in social matters. Knowing that, you would think she would have given him more than 24 hours to say something to her in response to her announcement of sterility before leaving town.
The other thing is that both of them have a huge chip of integrity, which is why William won't try to come between Julia and Darcy, AND why Julia won't throw Darcy over. The suggestion that Darcy forbids Julia to see William is the one thing that I can see causing a decision on Julia's part, so maybe that's how it happens.
I found it interesting that Brackenreid was the one to speak to Murdoch about Julia, rather than George. I've always felt George was closer to William, but then again, it's easier to speak to an underling or someone on your own level, rather than somebody ranked above you, on a touchy subject.
Hopefully the series gets the go-ahead soon for a 5th season....13 weeks followed by 39 weeks off is bad enough - the writers have me completely hooked on this series!
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Post by CosmicCavalcade on May 5, 2011 23:20:19 GMT
George might be closer but he's rather oblivious to Murdoch's romantic relationships. remember how earlier this season, George was wondering what was wrong with Murdoch and it was Higgins that said he was lovesick for Julia. but the reason you gave also explains why it was Brackenreid who talked to him.
i'm with you on the renewal. if this show doesn't continue for at least one more season, i'll be severely crushed.
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Post by hannikan on May 5, 2011 23:46:36 GMT
I think a large part of Julia taking the job in Buffalo had to do with William - I think she knows had she remained in Toronto, things would have remained the same with William, and I think she loves him more than she does herself. She sees herself as having given up the love of her life so that he can have the life he wants. But he was going to propose! I don't think that was just to keep her in Toronto, I think he wanted to anyway. But I think you're right that Julia thought things weren't going to progress. She was impatient and William moves kind of slowly. And I agree that she thinks she sacrificed her happiness for his. He thinks he is doing the same, of course. The interesting thing is that Julia knows fully well that William is obtuse in social matters. Knowing that, you would think she would have given him more than 24 hours to say something to her in response to her announcement of sterility before leaving town. Yeah, I do think she didn't give him any time to process it. She didn't even give him 24 hrs, she gave him one minute and then didn't tell him she was leaving the next day! The other thing is that both of them have a huge chip of integrity, which is why William won't try to come between Julia and Darcy, AND why Julia won't throw Darcy over. The suggestion that Darcy forbids Julia to see William is the one thing that I can see causing a decision on Julia's part, so maybe that's how it happens. Yeah, I agree they are both too strongly principled to carry on an affair. Yeah, somehow that's the only scenario I can see happening to get Julia to leave Darcy. And now that Darcy has some animosity toward William I think it's more likely that even though he won't been convicted, just because he's a suspect, Darcy will forbid Julia from spending time with William/work in the morgue. Julia would not give up either of those things. I found it interesting that Brackenreid was the one to speak to Murdoch about Julia, rather than George. I've always felt George was closer to William, but then again, it's easier to speak to an underling or someone on your own level, rather than somebody ranked above you, on a touchy subject. I think George will talk to him in the next episode, maybe at Ruby's prompting. She'll feel like she didn't get anywhere talking to William so she'll encourage George to speak to him. Thomas has talked to William about Julia before so I wasn't surprised about that. Hopefully the series gets the go-ahead soon for a 5th season....13 weeks followed by 39 weeks off is bad enough - the writers have me completely hooked on this series! I know!! |
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Post by Terence's Top Hat on Sept 1, 2011 21:24:48 GMT
This episode was so much fun. Welcome back, Ruby! And of course Patty got lots of air time, too. I read that a lot of viewers didn't like him? Aww, I think he's funny. Always stirring up Brackenreid. I had no idea it was Patty, though. That was a huge surprise for me.
The chemistry between George and Ruby almost flew off the TV screen LOL. I hope the writers get them together.
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Post by bookworm1225 on Nov 20, 2014 20:00:16 GMT
I was just watching this one - well, listening to it while at work, and occasionally peeking, especially peeking during the scene between William and Darcy at the end. And I just noticed something. When William tells Darcy that the past, his relationship with Julia, is dead and gone... he looks to the left!
Jasper's theory is confirmed! *laugh*
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Post by snacky on Nov 20, 2014 20:19:30 GMT
I was just watching this one - well, listening to it while at work, and occasionally peeking, especially peeking during the scene between William and Darcy at the end. And I just noticed something. When William tells Darcy that the past, his relationship with Julia, is dead and gone... he looks to the left! Jasper's theory is confirmed! *laugh* That is a very famous lie. captured in gif by our own CC!     The whole gifset is here: holy-matrimony-batman.tumblr.com/post/85488677932/i-see-what-you-did-there-show-and-i-liked-it-iThere was further commentary as it was reblogged. The latest gif diva on the block, MoreOfASpectacle, probably did this one as well! I confess, I didn't catch this glance when I first viewed the ep. But I was very impressed with all the people who did!!!! And I'm even more impressed that Yannick did it. Again, he's very underestimated as an actor, particularly when it comes to subtle facial gestures. Stuff like this is what elevates MM to a Cult level, IMHO. |
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Post by bookworm1225 on Nov 20, 2014 20:27:55 GMT
D'oh! Ahh, well. Sorry for repeating things. I didn't see it in this thread, so... *shrug*
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Post by snacky on Nov 20, 2014 20:33:49 GMT
Btw, I guess most of the discussion is in the William Murdoch section, but I've been pretty obsessed with this episode as a key to William's behavior. The part about failing to elicit a woman's passions shows that he feels he's lost a contest to Darcy. That same conversation shows a lot about where he thinks he's failed in being too cautious and not being the "grand gestures" type. He's curiously focusing on how he wasn't attractive enough for Julia instead of what he could have done differently, which is a very passive way to approach it.
Also, the conversation with Darcy sets up the later wedding problem as a matter of honor: William has now given his word.
For Julia the evidence is still building that William loved her after all (more or less confirmed in the Black Hand, but Ruby is hammering it home here). But she's also caught in a manner of honor, and all Ruby is doing is making her feel bad about a done deal.
I love the psychological complexity of these episodes - and really all of Season 4. Besides some ceiling staring in Tattered and Torn, William just soldiers ahead trying to process the destruction of his dreams as it unfolds right in front of him. A lesser show would have had him sulking and weeping over it rather than just cracking ever so slightly under the pressure as he attempts to interrogate a banker who may have been jilted for his dullness. A+ for dramatic conception!!!!
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Post by snacky on Nov 20, 2014 20:35:36 GMT
D'oh! Ahh, well. Sorry for repeating things. I didn't see it in this thread, so... *shrug* I think it's wonderful you caught it on your own! I didn't catch it all - I marvel at the people who did! Also that's a great way to get that discussion transported into this thread. This also made me notice that none of the VAST discussion on The Kissing Bandit is here.  I wonder where it is, lol. |
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Post by CosmicCavalcade on Nov 20, 2014 22:19:21 GMT
D'oh! Ahh, well. Sorry for repeating things. I didn't see it in this thread, so... *shrug* I think it's wonderful you caught it on your own! I didn't catch it all - I marvel at the people who did! Also that's a great way to get that discussion transported into this thread. This also made me notice that none of the VAST discussion on The Kissing Bandit is here. I wonder where it is, lol. It took me like 5 watches to spot that and put two and two together. I was probably making gifs at the time too for some other reason and just happened to notice this. Hardly obvious. And not necessarily conclusive of anything...but I like to think it is. |
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I wonder where it is, lol.