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Post by snacky on Oct 31, 2015 19:42:58 GMT
Re season 8. Thanks Carco. Never signed on to write a soap For me the dramatic purpose of W/J is to set up meaningful emotional dilemmas and raise the stakes whenever William and Julia make decisions that affect each other. A soap happens when the relationship is just exhibited for the sake of fan service, with no logical connection to the plots generated by the mysteries. Fan service is lame, but drama without emotional stakes is hollow. |
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Post by snacky on Oct 31, 2015 19:48:52 GMT
Further evidence to support this ‘theory’: in the companion book Ricci points out that the two women who pretended to be George’s mother were Emily and Gracie…but his real mother’s name is Gracie Brooks. So yes, they definitely like playing around with the names. It’s not just coincidence that they chose the name Lillian for Emily’s new/dead love interest. At least, not to me. And now I'm left wondering if this was somehow foreshadowing of epic proportions. Previously I didn't believe they planned on killing Lillian off. It was only after Georgina decided to leave that they decided this...but maybe they were always planning to off her all along so that George and Emily could get back together? I believe the BMOC episode took place before PM was on board as a writer or showrunner, and Emily Grace is his character. It would be gratifying to think that the writers do study the previous episodes to that extent. It seems to me the echo in the names is meant to be Jungian synchronicity: another play on the psychiatric explorations of the period. |
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Post by snacky on Oct 31, 2015 19:52:29 GMT
I always look at the tweets after the ep finishes, I couldn't take my eyes off the screen long enough before. Hah, another tweeter like me that tweet and watch.  I watch at 7 so I can tweet at 8 but when I watch at 8 I get so engrossed again that I forget to tweet. And I only joined tweet so I could tweet on Monday nights!!! I have to make due with tweets as much as 2 days before I watch: unfortunately the episodes are always spoiled for me, but I like to participate in the conversation here right when the show airs. I heard the BBC finally got wise in dealing with distribution for Sherlock, and it will air in the US on the same day as England. They tried to do the same with Stargate, but, IIRC, the eps still ended up 3 days off because of the SyFy channel's commitment to their SyFy Friday stack. |
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Post by murdochic on Oct 31, 2015 20:52:27 GMT
A lot of posters on here will have to agree to disagree with you about S8 observations. But we're still fans of the show and we're still watching and caring. I've enjoyed the first two episodes of S9, and they've made me happy to still be a fan. Now we're just worried about poor Emily, and Lillian. Hopefully you'll surprise us and she doesn't die, so both characters can leave alive. Whether together or apart. I know a lot of folks here didn't like S8 and I'm a huge fan of William and Julia so I felt a bit let down in that regard as well. But now I've randomly re-watched some of the episodes and found that I enjoyed them far more than I did last year. I'm assuming that's because I was watching the episode this time around, without hoping for a key "W/J" moment. There were some deeper, darker episodes last year that I can appreciate more now, in hindsight. I've come to realize this about myself....there is not one MM episode that I don't like. But over the years, there are a few episodes that I "under-appreciated" for whatever reason. Having said that, this is a thread for Double Life so I will have to go back and find the posts on that topic!! I was actually less satisfied with S8 when I rewatched it because it was then more apparent how much Julia and Emily were sidelined. That was my biggest problem with the season, it was structured badly IMO. It felt like the writers had struggled with ideas for the characters and were just adding a lot of recurring characters to fill up screentime. There were good episodes that I have no real problem with, but overall it wasn't really a successful season. I'd been enjoying S9, but I'll never be a fan of this episode as I think it was unnecessary to be done the way it was. It left a bad taste in my mouth because it was so cliche and unfair to Emily. I like the vast majority of episodes of MM, but there are some that are just badly handled so they stand out for the wrong reasons. MM isn't perfect, it's a great show in general but it has made mistakes sometimes. |
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Post by NightCrow on Oct 31, 2015 22:40:55 GMT
The first episode of MM I saw was the one where Julia's father died-which was a season finale. I was captivated by Helene because she looks so much like one of my high school history teacher who was everyone's favourite. I did not watch any other episode until this Summer where "Staircase to heaven" and "Invention Convention" aired on the same day. Georgina's acting and the guest appearance of my favourite dragon from Dragon's Den hooked me into the show. I then binged MM for the upcoming S9. Three episodes into it and I learn that my favourite character leaves the show.  I don't like the new actress who plays Rebecca. I have nothing against her skin colour, but I sincerly dislike her personality and other people like her, exhibitionist that is. A quick look in google image and voila. She does not fit with the other cast because of this and it will be hard for me to appreciate her character if I do not appreciate the actor behind. Hopefully, she goes away by the 10th Season. |
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Post by snacky on Oct 31, 2015 23:06:02 GMT
The first episode of MM I saw was the one where Julia's father died-which was a season finale. I was captivated by Helene because she looks so much like one of my high school history teacher who was everyone's favourite. I did not watch any other episode until this Summer where "Staircase to heaven" and "Invention Convention" aired on the same day. Georgina's acting and the guest appearance of my favourite dragon from Dragon's Den hooked me into the show. I then binged MM for the upcoming S9. Three episodes into it and I learn that my favourite character leaves the show. I don't like the new actress who plays Rebecca. I have nothing against her skin colour, but I sincerly dislike her personality and other people like her, exhibitionist that is. A quick look in google image and voila. She does not fit with the other cast because of this and it will be hard for me to appreciate her character if I do not appreciate the actor behind. Hopefully, she goes away by the 10th Season. Publicity shots and pictures from other roles on Google don't necessarily reflect the character that will be played on MM. When I originally saw Sara Mitich's pictures on Google, I assumed she would play some glamorous role - an intrepid Nelly Bly reporter or an adventurous archaeologist. The character of Lillian did not reflect that glamour at all, and in fact she looked rather plain. The look/make-up definitely affects character expectations as well. Once introduced on MM, I expected Lillian to be brusque and perhaps a bit crafty. |
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Post by NightCrow on Nov 1, 2015 3:06:56 GMT
My point is that the pictures reflect the actor. It's hard to like the role of an actor if you don't like the actor.
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Post by carco on Nov 1, 2015 3:18:48 GMT
Could Gladys have killed the PI? Idk- only got to watch once. Julia saying "What" when they said they needed a new coroner was my absolute favorite. Oh and not to mention William pointing out that there was still a foot in the boot. LOL. This episode was just really great throughout the whole thing! Yes, I forgot to mention that as well. I loved that "what?". So far, this is my favorite episode of the season! Loved it! I liked that moment too, not to mention the "problem solved" looks on Murdoch and Brakenreid's faces too! Didn't something like that happen once before? Was it in Victor/Victoria? |
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Post by snacky on Nov 1, 2015 3:24:54 GMT
My point is that the pictures reflect the actor. It's hard to like the role of an actor if you don't like the actor. I checked the images, and I don't see anything other than normal publicity shots. |
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Post by carco on Nov 1, 2015 3:44:20 GMT
When this episode started and I heard Julia talking to William about the snooty Empire Club event they were attending, my immediate thought was that Julia was being un-characteristically "catty".
Then I realized that the episode began with a shot of the head of a beautiful Tiger (cat). The Brakenreid's are there and Margaret is chomping at the bit (or should that be "scratching at the post") to find out if Thomas is going to be accepted. Julia tells William that Margaret looks like the "cat who ate the canary" and William refers to the Inspector as the "canary-eater". Meanwhile, back to the Brakenreid's where the one fellow asks if the other fellow has let the "cat out of the bag" yet.
It eventually dawned on me the next day, that there was this whole cat thing going on!! Sometimes there are so many layers to this show........
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Post by Hodge on Nov 1, 2015 3:55:21 GMT
When this episode started and I heard Julia talking to William about the snooty Empire Club event they were attending, my immediate thought was that Julia was being un-characteristically "catty". Then I realized that the episode began with a shot of the head of a beautiful Tiger (cat). The Brakenreid's are there and Margaret is chomping at the bit (or should that be "scratching at the post") to find out if Thomas is going to be accepted. Julia tells William that Margaret looks like the "cat who ate the canary" and William refers to the Inspector as the "canary-eater". Meanwhile, back to the Brakenreid's where the one fellow asks if the other fellow has let the "cat out of the bag" yet. It eventually dawned on me the next day, that there was this whole cat thing going on!! Sometimes there are so many layers to this show........ I think Margaret was supposed to be the canary eater whom the Inspector was trying to keep happy. Wonder why all the cat references.... Didn't exactly fit in with the rest of the ep. Btw, I think this is in the wrong thread.  |
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Post by carco on Nov 1, 2015 4:48:25 GMT
I was reading a story in the Toronto Star about the new Suffragette movie. It led me to find out more about Emily Davison and I found this site (link attached): TruthIt was an interesting article as I don't recall knowing very much about her previously. I found it fascinating the article mentioned that during the event (1913) they had actually been filming the Derby using three camera angles and that later they were able to combine the three angles into one view. From that new advanced view they were able to correct a pre-conception about her motive because they could more accurately determine where she had been standing originally. Which was pretty much exactly what William did in "Back and to the Left". After the article, there are links to other Suffragette stories. One discusses the lesbian factor within the Suffragette movement at that time. Another story, I think it was the one on Christabel Pankhurst, mentions the various destructive actions they were taking.. not the least of which was setting fires and throwing bricks through windows. The site is British and the movement was far more entrenched there than in Toronto and this all took place about 10 years later than when MM takes place. So whether or not I liked the idea of Emily with Lillian and whether or not I thought Lillian was far more serious and gung-ho about the whole suffragette movement than Emily or even Julia, I have to acknowledge that those story lines/arcs do run parallel to actual historical events.
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Post by carco on Nov 1, 2015 5:10:02 GMT
The first episode of MM I saw was the one where Julia's father died-which was a season finale. I was captivated by Helene because she looks so much like one of my high school history teacher who was everyone's favourite. I did not watch any other episode until this Summer where "Staircase to heaven" and "Invention Convention" aired on the same day. Georgina's acting and the guest appearance of my favourite dragon from Dragon's Den hooked me into the show. I then binged MM for the upcoming S9. Three episodes into it and I learn that my favourite character leaves the show. I don't like the new actress who plays Rebecca. I have nothing against her skin colour, but I sincerly dislike her personality and other people like her, exhibitionist that is. A quick look in google image and voila. She does not fit with the other cast because of this and it will be hard for me to appreciate her character if I do not appreciate the actor behind. Hopefully, she goes away by the 10th Season. With all due respect, maybe you should just pass on S10 and see how S11 looks for you? Wow, not only are you losing Georgina this season but your favourite Dragon left the Den too. I'd say 'It sucks to be you' but I think you'd take it the wrong way, so I won't. |
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Post by snacky on Nov 1, 2015 6:13:44 GMT
After the article, there are links to other Suffragette stories. One discusses the lesbian factor within the Suffragette movement at that time. Another story, I think it was the one on Christabel Pankhurst, mentions the various destructive actions they were taking.. not the least of which was setting fires and throwing bricks through windows. The site is British and the movement was far more entrenched there than in Toronto and this all took place about 10 years later than when MM takes place. So whether or not I liked the idea of Emily with Lillian and whether or not I thought Lillian was far more serious and gung-ho about the whole suffragette movement than Emily or even Julia, I have to acknowledge that those story lines/arcs do run parallel to actual historical events.
This is what I've been saying! The critique of husbands as enslaving and/or deforming the natural evolution of women was also historical. It was the female version of debating Foucault in the coffee shop. |
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Post by snacky on Nov 1, 2015 6:25:36 GMT
When this episode started and I heard Julia talking to William about the snooty Empire Club event they were attending, my immediate thought was that Julia was being un-characteristically "catty". Then I realized that the episode began with a shot of the head of a beautiful Tiger (cat). The Brakenreid's are there and Margaret is chomping at the bit (or should that be "scratching at the post") to find out if Thomas is going to be accepted. Julia tells William that Margaret looks like the "cat who ate the canary" and William refers to the Inspector as the "canary-eater". Meanwhile, back to the Brakenreid's where the one fellow asks if the other fellow has let the "cat out of the bag" yet. It eventually dawned on me the next day, that there was this whole cat thing going on!! Sometimes there are so many layers to this show........ I think Margaret was supposed to be the canary eater whom the Inspector was trying to keep happy. Wonder why all the cat references.... Didn't exactly fit in with the rest of the ep. Btw, I think this is in the wrong thread. I agree, it doesn't really count as symbolism unless you know at least one meaning for the symbol. I'll have to take another look at that scene and try to figure out what the cat is up to. Did Mark Twain write anything related to cats? |
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I watch at 7 so I can tweet at 8 but when I watch at 8 I get so engrossed again that I forget to tweet. And I only joined tweet so I could tweet on Monday nights!!! 
Jan 30, 2013 21:44:55 GMT
Jan 30, 2013 21:44:55 GMT