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Post by snacky on Mar 20, 2014 3:10:56 GMT
Something has seemed off to me about the Julia/William relationship. While they have chemistry, I never get the impression they want to rip each other's clothes off. Well, Bloodlust shows Julia has fantasies of bodice-ripping, but that was *her* fantasy, and she's entirely the agent of that seduction: she is the one tempting and provoking, she is the one "giving it" to William. William enjoys it when Julia pulls him in for a kiss, but otherwise he's fairly passive about the whole thing. There have even been hints that William is still saving himself for marriage even though Julia is no virgin. His only serious reference to their sexual relationship was tied firmly to producing children, and that creeped Julia out so much that she fled to Buffalo. At first I put William's reticence down to shyness and Victorian manners and perhaps some class insecurity. But after pondering it some what, I wondered if there might be a religious aspect. Not so much deference to rules and notions of sin, but rather the influence of religious iconography. The Jesuits are particularly known for " spiritual exercises" that involve focusing their meditation on beautiful images. Julia has the features of an angel: willowy, ethereal, glorious hair more golden blond with every passing season. William probably imagines her wearing white, wispy as an El Greco painting, perhaps even with wings. William doesn't merely love Julia, he adores her. Julia's actual personality, which challenges God and society at the drop of a chapeau, contradicts her usefulness as a Divine Vision - so I suppose her personality supports the part of William that wants to defy an oppressive status quo. But William's image of Julia as an angel is delicate and fragile: if he grasps her too hard, she might break apart in his hands. William has no problem envisioning a hot encounter with Eva Pearce. When he thinks of Julia, on the other hand, he thinks of how "lovely" she is and how he wants to fall on his knees before her to propose. I wonder if Julia suspects she is being put on a pedestal. If Wiliam has over-spiritualized their relationship in some respect, I wonder how he can break out of that and see Julia as a whole, earthly woman? |
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Post by snacky on Mar 20, 2014 17:46:56 GMT
This is an interesting theory, but I seem to recall quite a few fantasies of William's in Murdoch Mysteries' early days. These fantasies generally regarded Julia- for example, when he pictures her sans clothes in 'Houdini Whodunit'. This indicates that he does have some rip-off-her-clothes feelings, but he manages to conceal or even surpress them due to his religion. He claims that she is 'lovely' and wants to marry her because he loves her, beyond his lust- there's a balance, that makes their relationship work- and he wants to do it all right, in terms of marriage. If he ever regarded Julia as an angel, I'm certain that said vision shattered a long time ago, if we take into account all of her actions and statements. I agree about the blonde part, though her hair has definitely reverted back to a darker, more reddish blonde color- and I must say, it looks a lot better of Julia, though she could probably rock any hair color. XD I'm not sure envisioning Julia naked is the same as wanting to rip her clothes off: there's a lot of nudity in religious imagery. Eve, for instance, would usually be painted without clothes. Regarding Julia shattering the angelic image, I wonder if William's religious repression results in seeing Julia in two different ways. Instead of a Madonna/Whore complex, maybe he has an Angel/Rebel complex? |
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Post by snacky on Mar 21, 2014 4:57:19 GMT
Some more thoughts on this. 1) While he still waited for Anna to make the first move, William was much more aggressive toward Anna. That might have been because he didn't know who he was and thus also didn't know what he was *trying* to be as William Murdoch. (i.e., both religiously devout and upper class "proper"). 2) William doesn't hesitate to kiss Julia. I think he has the Romantic poets in mind. First, Julia has declared she loves the Romantic poets. (Though it's possible William could be referring to the Song of Solomon or his own preference for 17th century poets. For instance John Donne's The Ecstasy). During that era it was also common to regard earthly love as a ladder to divine love. Also the Jesuits told William he was too analytical for literary (humanistic) pursuits. William defied that by appreciating Shakespeare. "This One Stops at Eleven" showed he also took a stab at appreciating fine art, though he's more interested in technique than interpretation. In "Anything You Can Do" William stole Julia's book on the Romantic poets, and his brother told him the chapter on Symbolism was the best part. I think it's safe to assume he read it, and tried to absorb some style from it. |
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Post by carco on May 24, 2014 20:56:13 GMT
I do think William adores Julia and possibly he put her on a pedestal early in their relationship but I think he now sees her as the multi-layered woman that she is. He has come to recognize and accept her faults but he is still devoted to her. And yes, I think she knew he put her on a pedestal back when she first told him about her abortion in Shades of Grey. Despite saying he would deal with it and get past it, she knew he had absolutely no idea just how much he personally, would need to come to terms with both mentally and spiritually to get past this one "truth" about her. IF he ever could.
By the same token, Julia has always loved William too but she has never been blind to the fact that he has a lot of "issues".
I also agree with MelodyPond101 in that William does have the usual male urges but it seems to be his religious background and his religion itself that makes him keep a tight lid on those urges. I also agree that his words and actions around Anna when they were in Bristol, seems to prove that theory too. He didn't know who he was or what his background was so he was acting like any normal male would do around a pretty young woman.
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Post by snacky on May 24, 2014 22:27:32 GMT
I do think William adores Julia and possibly he put her on a pedestal early in their relationship but I think he now sees her as the multi-layered woman that she is. He has come to recognize and accept her faults but he is still devoted to her. And yes, I think she knew he put her on a pedestal back when she first told him about her abortion in Shades of Grey. Despite saying he would deal with it and get past it, she knew he had absolutely no idea just how much he personally, would need to come to terms with both mentally and spiritually to get past this one "truth" about her. IF he ever could. By the same token, Julia has always loved William too but she has never been blind to the fact that he has a lot of "issues". I also agree with MelodyPond101 in that William does have the usual male urges but it seems to be his religious background and his religion itself that makes him keep a tight lid on those urges. I also agree that his words and actions around Anna when they were in Bristol, seems to prove that theory too. He didn't know who he was or what his background was so he was acting like any normal male would do around a pretty young woman. Those pedestal worries could explain why Julia kept taking preemptive steps to break up (before she falls off the pedestal). Previously I thought Julia was too quick to assume what William was thinking. But having just watched Shades of Grey again, I think it's clear that William did have some issues to work through before he could truly love Julia. In regard to Bristol - I just realized even if William's memory was lost, he did sort of remember he was Catholic and they were staying in a Catholic church! Anna was clearly issuing an invitation, though. That corset move did look practiced to me. >.> |
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Post by wildhorseannie on May 25, 2014 4:51:17 GMT
A lot of great thoughts! I may add that during the early seasons, part of the reason William may have held Julia on such "pedestals" is that they were both rather closed off to each other in terms of their personal lives. He because of his personal "issues," she because of her fears of his reaction. On the contrary, Anna was very open with William, and because of his vulnerable position, he was very open with her as well. This paved the way for them to become close very quickly. Even though he ultimately chose Julia, the bond that he and Anna had forged was immediately evident when she returned in "The Black Hand."
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Post by snacky on May 25, 2014 5:32:27 GMT
A lot of great thoughts! I may add that during the early seasons, part of the reason William may have held Julia on such "pedestals" is that they were both rather closed off to each other in terms of their personal lives. He because of his personal "issues," she because of her fears of his reaction. On the contrary, Anna was very open with William, and because of his vulnerable position, he was very open with her as well. This paved the way for them to become close very quickly. Even though he ultimately chose Julia, the bond that he and Anna had forged was immediately evident when she returned in "The Black Hand." Anna shall return!  And William continues to be very much more natural with her. But in a way, I think the ways in which he's not at ease with Julia is part of why he loves her. She remains a mystery. And not always an angelic one. Occasionally she shocks the socks off of him, like when she pointed out all human beings were animals (at least as far as sexual urges go). |
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Post by wildhorseannie on May 25, 2014 5:50:10 GMT
Yay! I totally ship Anna/William!
Anyways, I do agree that Julia's "mystery" is part of her intrigue for William. And after she opened up with him, it enabled him to feel emotionally closer to her, despite his misgivings about her past.
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Post by snacky on May 25, 2014 6:05:14 GMT
Yay! I totally ship Anna/William! Anyways, I do agree that Julia's "mystery" is part of her intrigue for William. And after she opened up with him, it enabled him to feel emotionally closer to her, despite his misgivings about her past. One of William's flaws seems to be a low tolerance for change. Anna will later make him an offer that I kind of feel that he should have taken her up on, despite my Jilliam bias. Right now I'm wondering how Julia will even get him out of the country for the honeymoon. >.< Somewhere inside him is a total fraidycat! Perhaps someone needs to knock him over the head so his adventurous Murdoch Identity persona can come out. (The Yukon - out of character or exception that proved the rule when he came slinking back to Station House 4?) |
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Post by wildhorseannie on May 25, 2014 18:06:22 GMT
The Yukon was certainly interesting, because he's mentioned several times that he was previously a logger. Murdoch as a lumberjack is an image that I never could quite wrap my head around. However, if it is true, then he should be perfectly at home in the Yukon. And clearly, even though the environment was different, he was still able to access his vast knowledge to his advantage and made the claim work where others around him were failing.
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Post by snacky on May 25, 2014 18:48:32 GMT
The Yukon was certainly interesting, because he's mentioned several times that he was previously a logger. Murdoch as a lumberjack is an image that I never could quite wrap my head around. However, if it is true, then he should be perfectly at home in the Yukon. And clearly, even though the environment was different, he was still able to access his vast knowledge to his advantage and made the claim work where others around him were failing. The logging background might fit with his upbringing in the books, but it really doesn't make any sense on the TV show unless something traumatic happened that totally changed William's personality. Actually that might make an awesome episode. Are you listening CBC?! There hasn't been a logging camp episode yet. And inquiring minds want to know what would turn a guy from a rugged logger into a highly withdrawn Gentleman of Science! Seriously, William has more in common with the Jesuits that educated him. As for surviving in the Yukon - he was raised in a desolate area, and his personality can withstand long bouts of communing in nature, pace John Muir. And he looked good in the outfit! Have you seen any of the episodes of Nothing too Good for a Cowboy? *wolf whistle* |
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Post by wildhorseannie on May 25, 2014 19:05:38 GMT
I have seen one episode of "Nothing too Good for a Cowboy." Pretty nice!  But definitely not our Murdoch! Now that you have the attention of the bigwigs with your review, snacky, you definitely need to send them a message about these ideas! Make the logging camp-back story happen! |
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Post by snacky on May 25, 2014 19:27:49 GMT
I have seen one episode of "Nothing too Good for a Cowboy." Pretty nice! But definitely not our Murdoch! Now that you have the attention of the bigwigs with your review, snacky, you definitely need to send them a message about these ideas! Make the logging camp-back story happen! I posted something under the William Murdoch section - I don't know where else to put it. :/ That is a pretty obvious "missing episode" though. Thanks for pointing that out! |
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Post by carco on May 26, 2014 19:10:37 GMT
The Yukon was certainly interesting, because he's mentioned several times that he was previously a logger. Murdoch as a lumberjack is an image that I never could quite wrap my head around. However, if it is true, then he should be perfectly at home in the Yukon. And clearly, even though the environment was different, he was still able to access his vast knowledge to his advantage and made the claim work where others around him were failing. The logging background might fit with his upbringing in the books, but it really doesn't make any sense on the TV show unless something traumatic happened that totally changed William's personality. Actually that might make an awesome episode. Are you listening CBC?! There hasn't been a logging camp episode yet. And inquiring minds want to know what would turn a guy from a rugged logger into a highly withdrawn Gentleman of Science! Seriously, William has more in common with the Jesuits that educated him. As for surviving in the Yukon - he was raised in a desolate area, and his personality can withstand long bouts of communing in nature, pace John Muir. And he looked good in the outfit! Have you seen any of the episodes of Nothing too Good for a Cowboy? *wolf whistle* They already said some time ago that for this season (8) they are doing an episode (or maybe its the 2 parter---not sure) about Murdoch's life from about the age of 9 onward. So the logging camp days, etc. are possibly already written up. |
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Post by wildhorseannie on May 26, 2014 19:30:40 GMT
Awesome! Can't wait! Does anyone know how soon the episodes become available in the U.S. after they air in Canada? They are on Season 7 now, so when will that become available?
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But definitely not our Murdoch! Now that you have the attention of the bigwigs with your review, snacky, you definitely need to send them a message about these ideas! Make the logging camp-back story happen!